Monday, 22 August 2011

Confusing Believers with Facts

Let me start by saying something which seems to often cause deep offence: SHOW ME YOUR EVIDENCE. I know this is a very shocking thing to ask anyone to do, especially if the evidence relates to such sensitive matters as the existence of a deity. I mean, frankly, believers often act as though they couldn't be more offended if I asked them to perform some deeply erotic act.

The simply truth is most believers have never seriously considered the question of evidence for God. They were taught about God in early childhood and regard his existence as a self evident truth. They are very shocked when told that there is no more evidence for God than for Santa Claus. Often this simply fact causes them to get very indignant.
"Don't be ridicules!" they tweet at me.
I calmly reply by asking them to provide any available evidence for God.
"Well the evidence is all around you. Everything in the world is evidence for God."
"Like the Ebola virus," I helpfully suggest.
That stumps them. First they have to google the the word "Ebola", just to check. Then they have to explain how God can be responsible for everything but somehow evade responsible for the Ebola virus. Many stop tweeting at that point. They remember all the other important things the need to do rather than tweet. But there are the determined ones.
The determined believers argue sin is the result of the "Fall of Man." They tweet this proud of the clever answer they have come up with and certain they have put me in my place.
Unfortunately, for them, that answer does not end the matter. I point out that if there was an all knowing God he would have known everything that would have in the world BEFORE HE MADE IT. I further point out that any human who intentionally does something, knowing the consequences will be harmful, will be held responsible for it. That is what the word "culpability" means. I It can hardly be reasonable to expect God to have lower standards than humans.
"But evil came about as the result of free will."
"Precisely how can free will create viruses?" I ask. The memory of my schooldays, when I'd wished I could have developed a virus to get me out of Latin class, comes to mind. I wonder if perhaps if I'd only used a bit more free will. Sadly they never come up with the formula that eluded me .In fact, at this point, they frequently seem to lose the train of their argument.
"What about Stalin and Hitler?" they tweet.
As you can imagine I struggle to see the connection between this and my last questiont but I try to be helpful. I point out that Hitler wasn't an Atheist and even provide a link to a very instructive Youtube video featuring Christopher Hitchens.
Do you know there are some believers who just can't get this video to play? Anyway, asking them to view it shows how hateful and closed minded I am. Well they have a point. How can it ever be fair to argue with Christians simply by using facts? After all they've managed to maintain their faith for years and years without ever examining any.


  1. you just blocked me on twitter, running away from a discussion with somebody who isn't even a strongly religious person. you answer none of my questins, fail to discuss any of my points and instead label me as a deluded believer who is unwilling to accept what you have to say. I never condoned religious violence or attacked your right for free speech but merely said you had "no MORE right to attack someones beliefs any MORE than somebody had to attack yours" if you are an educated man you would know that that is saying in essence "respect everyones opinions". the fact that you manipulate a comment to run away from an argument makes me respect you even less then standing up and having a civilised discussion.

  2. The man is a deluded fool who takes great delight in sharing his spiteful views but then struggles to debate and argue against someone who is his intellectually superior. He runs away from such debates by blocking those that he cannot argue against because of his small narrow minded views.

  3. LOL, it's not that he can't argue against you fuckwits, it's just that you have nothing to argue against. There is no argument. There is no debate. There is no god.

    Get some evidence and pull your collective heads out of your arses and then try again. It should be simple right, you've got the fucking almighty creator of the universe on your side after all.


    1. You are wrong...he can't argue. He Does run from debates and as other fools, typically call foul when follied. Oh, and proof? He hates can one hate something that doesn't exist? Sorry, that IS impossible. So, if he really had some smarts he & you, for that matter, could easily realize that by hating something with such passion actually proves it exists at least in your own minds. eyecutwo. actually I see right through you.

  4. If there is a God, he would be so vastly superior to us that any attempt to try to discover him would be laughable at best, our tiny little brains would not be able to process it's true form or motive because the scope of it's existence would be beyond measure. In short.. inconceivable.

  5. Show me the evidence for no God. I have shown you the evidence for God but you do not have any evidence for your propaganda.

  6. God is utterly not apparent. There are no answered prayers that wouldnt have just happened anyway... no amputees being healed... no visitations of jesus, (or any such being) which the bible shows he can do for hundreds, but not us apparently. There is nothing divinely magical happening in the universe, its all wishful thinking and subjective feelings. Unless you are prepared to go out and kill all Atheists then you already dont believe the entirety of your holy story... and you should stop hurting the world by suggesting its ok act badly by faith. You do this by deciding anything on faith... which validates the anything of evil believer. You should be ashamed. ~Artie @atheisticearth